How far will you go for love?

He'll call you. Guys like that like knowing they have "hand" over as many girls as possible. He'll smell your weak desire for him a mile away.

I have a strong handle on people and motives because I am interested in the truth in motives. I think this stems from the fact that I have a tendency to believe the lies that people tell themselves. Your situation is identical - this guy doesn't think he's a jackass at all. He doesn't think he's wronged you. He's lying to himself. He's lying to himself by not trying to empathize with the pain you may go through as a result of his actions. He thinks he's a good guy.

You believed it, which is why you find yourself in the situation you are in. So the reasons that lead me to understand people and relationships better are the same reasons you have to understand him better - to see reality and the true nature of things.

For example, I think you are interested in everything I am saying... and I hope that you will use it. However, I do feel that you are here to try to gain some escape from your pain. Feasibly, therefore, you will not heed the advice in this thread and once you successfully find another form of escape, you will take that.

I don't know this for fact, but it is more likely than the alternative. So, I'm learning how to observe people by interacting with you. This is how I learn to see people and their motives pretty well.

"Hating everyone protects me from elitism."

I really feel for you mudd. Decius has certainly got love sussed (or should I say people). It's really hard the first time you fall in love because you fall the hardest of all when you realise that it doesn't quite work the way you thought it would.

I personally believe that love is the strongest power in the world (Decius will probably disagree) but when you have this power at work in your life its is so powerful. I've learnt from bitter personal experience never to really give that power away. I don't mean don't love anyone, that's different, but the hold it can have over you when you are vulnerable can be just too strong sometimes.

I think the vulnerability that exists in you when you fall in love has to be kept in check, because if you give too much power to the other person in the relationship it's not fair on them and its not fair on you because the power you give them means they are completely and utterly responsible for you emotionally. Don't give that power away keep it close to you and then you won't be as easily burnt by it when it all goes terribly wrong. Equally don't take the other person's because then yu are holding too much power over them. Does any of this make sense? I've found that love can be too powerful and relationships need really careful balancing out to work long-term, then respect can fill the gap.

""Each child holds the world in an open hand to mould it into any shape they choose.""

I don't understand your suggestion. Are you saying she should prevent herself from loving someone as fully as she can for fear of pain?

You're saying love is the most powerful force in the universe, then you immediately suggest keeping it suppressed?

Everything I've said, everything Wyote has said, supports the opposite reaction, geared specifically to AVOID doing what you seem to be suggesting. Her love should never be suppressed or controlled. You're suggesting she lose her innocence.

She has to maintain her innocence, and become more intelligent. So she doesn't have to fear what she has suffered in the past. If you remain even slightly less loving than you can be with your partner, then you certainly have chosen the path of fear over strength.

It is strong to love fully and wholeheartedly and completely, even if there's a chance it will fail. There's always that chance. It's cowardly to hide it. Then you're saying "hey you... you, yeah, the first guy that ever hurt me. I want you to know that I will remember you for the rest of my life, and because of what you did to me, I am going to change how i love every other person I ever meet from now on."

I can't understate how awful your suggestion is Sorceress. Even though you are being honest, there is no logical basis for what you are saying to be a positive solution in any way whatsoever, and I suggest you try to undo what you've done to yourself.

"Hating everyone protects me from elitism."

No that's not what I am saying at all and I think you have certainly misunderstood me. you can never give or recieve too much love, my issue is with the power love can have over yourself as an individual and how that power can sap you of your own will and self control. That a partner can hold love against you even if it is unknowingly or unintentionally done. I think young girls especially need to guard against the type of negative emotional bondage that love can trap you in if you let it. That is the power I am suggesting you not give away. Not love itself or the positive emotional attachment that comes with a loving relationship. I know it sounds confusing! I don't know how else to explain it.

""Each child holds the world in an open hand to mould it into any shape they choose.""

I really agree with decius on this one.

This whole love thing, in order for it to 'function properly', requires both sides to reciprocate that feeling you get deep inside. If one does not give their side of the love to the other (in this case, straight out leaving and being with another girl) the magnitude of pain, betrayal, and hate comes into play, in comparison to how much you believed you loved that person.

realizing how much energy, time, emotions you built up for so long, -kind of- like a kid building the best snow man you've ever seen and someone coming up to it and destroying it. And that other person has no sympathy or regret for what they have destroyed and what impact it may have had, because it no longer concerns him if he had not built up the same "emotional snowman" you did.

so my suggestion, like decius, learn from what has happened. But start over and protect your emotions, as in, not giving them carelessly away with the mindset of you loving someone as much as you might, expecting and assuming they love you just as much. Analytically observing your relationship deciding for yourself how much of your time and energy is worth putting into the relationship [if you knew him like this at the start of the relationship, you wouldn't have invested so much time and energy](If i recall this is from wyote)... I think if you put just as much emotion into a relationship as the other, it balances itself out. There is always a chance it will fail, and if it does, you know inside that you didn't over-do yourself by putting in or giving to much which seems to be the problem in the first place.

"I'm a human being, God Dammit!! My life has value!!!"

Mugen: Perfect advice.

Sorceress: Well, I basically think that you should only prevent yourself from loving anyone who may put you in a state of bondage. But you have to be reasonable about this. As Mugen said, you have to use your analytical skills to do this. My problem with what you are saying is you are not specifying that she should protect her emotions from bad people - you seem to be saying everyone, which certainly can't be correct.

The likelyhood of her meeting someone who will reciprocate them is very unlikely, but nevertheless, she has to keep that possibility open.

"Hating everyone protects me from elitism."

so now that ill have to deal with him at school, how should i deal with him? Like I said he has me when he's around, and when he's not around Im fine. What should I do?

""LIe to me",she whispered. "I love you",he said."

well if you show if that he "has you" when you're around him that's only going to give him power. the lesson here is to test your will power and see him just as another person in your class. begin the process of acknowledging him only as another human being that you would no longer like any relation with. perhaps adding in short talk, or responses to him if he tries to talk to you that insinuates that your not interested anymore.

look around your class for another guy you would never think of dating, would not really talk to and that is essentially your "goal" for getting him off your mind. If you can assemble yourself while around this guy and not have second thoughts about him, then you've solved this problem.

- Prove to him that he does not have power over you..

"I'm a human being, God Dammit!! My life has value!!!"

It gets easier, trust me.

I had a pretty bad break up a couple years ago, with me and my girlfriend of 2 and half years.

And for a couple months, I was in the gutter. Down and depressed about everything. I coulnd't stop thinking about her, I couldn't go out and have fun because every girl I saw made me think of her, but really all I needed was time. I know it might seem like you will NEVER get over him right now, but you will, trust me. ^_^

"Aint flashed a smile in a long while...."

sorry to keep bringing this up guys.. , but I really need help. So today was the first day back to school. I didn't see you know who at all. Then at lunch when I was with a group of friends I seen him talking to a girl, then he kept walking around. So I tried to ignore him and look away. Then I told my friend Jeremy that I was going to go to the library, and my ex follows me there. He goes to the same book section that Im in and acts like he's looking for a book, and the entire time he's not saying anything, then he walks away. The thing is he only went to the library because he heard me say that I was going there. And he has a new girlfriend, so why do you think he's doing this? And what should I do back?

""LIe to me",she whispered. "I love you",he said."

Almost exactly what decius predicted(calling), only he physically followed you. The way it appears to me right now, is that he's still thinking of your well being or perhaps seeing if you have moved on just as readily as he has. Now, not knowing the entire specifics of yours or his (in particular) mental nature, it's a bit difficult to tell whether he has followed you for a positive or a negative reason.

Although he has seemed to "moved on" and found another girlfriend, the experiences that you two have shared and the literally chemical bond you've created in yourselves are still present. So, there is that possibility that he is still thinking of you in a positive way.

Then again, like I said, if he truly has "moved on" and is acting upon jealousy that you seemed happy to him that you are conducting yourself normally given the information you now know about him, he may be upset that you are unaffected and some plan to hurt you could have blown up in his face.


It really could go either way.. but like we said previous, analyze this situation further and find for yourself what this has turned in to. Whether it be positive or negative. And from there, you may be able to decide for yourself what you think you should or should not do.

"I'm a human being, God Dammit!! My life has value!!!"

okay, so today... I didn't see him alot which was perfectly fine with me. Then he got on our bus, he called his girlfriend and was talking to her so that i could hear what he was saying, then he left... I feel so crappy.. I feel like I just want to die I am honestly seeing no point in living right now. Everything is starting to suck, I tried to look for a new guy but I don't like anyone but my ex at this point... my friends are there but they're not... I don't know what the hell I should do... please help.

""LIe to me",she whispered. "I love you",he said."

Well, mudd, you have to keep in mind and accept that this is not going to be an over night process. This isn't going to be something that's simple and easy to do either. You have to go through an emotional transformation that allows yourself to break those bonds you have with this guy.

What you have is an "addiction". And like any addiction, you can try two things here. You can either cold turkey it and see how strong you will power is until you actually get over it, or you can ween yourself off of this emotional addiction slowly but definitely. (from what I think, an addiction is simply when you are not in control over your own emotions over said addiction)

"I'm a human being, God Dammit!! My life has value!!!"

mudd, it has been some time since your orginal post. I pray things are going better for you. If not consider focusing on your friends and doing other things that you enjoy. Also, if you are still having problems you may need to talk to someone about them. Consider talking to a priest, rabbi, or pastor about your thoughts and feelings.
I wish you the best.

"Life is an adventure of discovery."