Religion has history - Page 3

Perhaps this the problem, you feel you need the institution rather than being part of the life?
As they say Jesus could only be lowered if He was above so too if you need to enter only if you are outside?

[But man is man...and shall never be equal to Christ and God the Father...and this is why we need to go to church!]

Huh? Excuse me? Thats it, I can't stand it.
Christianity is a false religion. Just like the other monotheistic religions (Islam, Judism), they were created by man. The theory of One God was used by power hungry men who equated the theory with one ruler. There is only one god, I am the ruler who was chosen by this god. Hence the Pope, get it?

Josiah, King Akhenaton, Constantine, Mohammed and Abraham all had a vested interest in seeing the One God theory succeed. They profited greatly by fooling the masses. Go ahead, prove me wrong.

Yea, you are right...who needs law and order...and who needs leaders??

Get rid of em all...and let's do what the FREE thinkers do....just adjust ourselves according to how we FEEL we should do.

We certainly don't need law and order...and definitely do not need leaderships....

Heck...man set up the rules to govern nations, states, cities, and all areas of life.

How much better we could be without the precepts or concepts of forgiveness, and doing unto others as we do unto ourselves.....and who needs the laws of christianity....

Heck man made the universe too...

Man is so efficient, we do not need anything but ourselves to choose what rules need apply.

Well, caveman says so....

Um, so if we can steal, murder, pillage, rape, molest, attack, covet, and what not...it is ok....cos after all...these are all man made laws. .............and what need do we have them...right buddy?

I sure have no clue why.....fill me in.

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Christianity is a false religion. Just like the other monotheistic religions (Islam, Judism), they were created by man. The theory of One God was used by power hungry men who equated the theory with one ruler.

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Is Christianity a false religion?
Good thing you didn't include Jesus in those because if He prospered ,
it wasn't in this World.
It is not money which is evil but rather those things
which man is willing to do for it.
It is not the preception of GOD (monotheisis belief)
but what man did in the name of it that is wrong.

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Yea, you are right...who needs law and order...and who needs leaders?? Heck...man set up the rules to govern nations, states, cities, and all areas of life.

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Do we need false leaders & teachers to lead us astray from truth?
Those who would lie & decieve just to fill their greed.
GOD knows we have enough of that on our own!

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Well, caveman says so.... Whom do you imply with this note? Just to be strait forward.

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Oh, by the Way the Church is the people not an institution.

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Well....it is impossible to have peace on earth, because as man....and women.
we still have sin on earth...and in our mortal states.

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Or is as long as man loves the Lie more than the Truth such shall continue?

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Josiah, King Akhenaton, Constantine, Mohammed and Abraham all had a vested interest in seeing the One God theory succeed. They profited greatly by fooling the masses. Go ahead, prove me wrong.

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Interesting theory. I believe in the One God theory, I also believe in the Trinity, and I also believe as some Hindu (there are many parts of God). I'm not going to waste my time trying figure out or decide what God is, because I will never get it.

I'm not a Christian, but I don't believe that the Christian religion, I just don't believe it is true. Within all teachings you will find truth and falsehood. If I belong to no religion, I am free to explore all truths and all lies. For some people, this is difficult, they have to belong to something. They are no less then I, just different.

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Now, Okcity, because someone can see the need for war vs sitting back and just hoping things work out...and you disagree does NOT make your ideals better...or worse.
Just different.

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You're not in Iraq fighting, you're doing the same thing as I am doing. (sitting back). Don't lecture me about sitting back. I served my country for 14 years, I know what it means.

There is a man who volunteered to go to Iraq and fight because he believed it was the right thing to do. He died and is a hero, I respect him. I respect all those who are over there.

But who the hell are you. The way you talk, you should be over there.

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sitting back and just hoping things work out.

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Now just what was supposed to work out? Tell me again why any of our soldiers had to go to Iraq and die, and tell me why you aren't there?

[Um, so if we can steal, murder, pillage, rape, molest, attack, covet, and what not...it is ok....cos after all...these are all man made laws]

Deut. 2.34 was the result of god giving the ok to commit mass murder in his name. 'Heck', do you think this is ok? I know of no law made by man, in our country anyway, that states murder in the name of religion is ok, do you?

[...who needs law and order...and who needs leaders??]

You're so silly. I'll agree to this, we don't need leaders who answer to a 'higher authority', ie G. W. Bush. Another example is the story of Josiah. He single handedly set the tone for mans corruptive abuse of religion.

[Good thing you didn't include Jesus in those because if He prospered ,
it wasn't in this World.]

Good point, but I don't believe Jesus was trying to rule anything. He saw the corruptive side and tried to fix it. By the way, his wasn't the only 'sect' at that time. There were many others that regarded the Jewish collaboration with the Romans as treasonist.

[If I belong to no religion, I am free to explore all truths and all lies. For some people, this is difficult, they have to belong to something. They are no less then I, just different.]

Couldn't have said it better myself OK. Thats been my point from the beginning. Believe what you want, but don't distort history to justify anything.

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I'm not a Christian, but I don't believe that the Christian religion, I just don't believe it is true.

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I'm not a Christian, but I don't believe that the Christian religion (is false), I just don't believe it is true.

Sorry, sometimes I get into a hurry and miss words.

Thanks Imn2caves - we must be cut from the same mold. Distortion is right, just three years ago I learned the truth about Columbus. Hitler must have been Columbus in an earlier life. He was one wicked dude.

How is that OKCity?

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Or is as long as man loves the Lie more than the Truth such shall continue?

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The lie is in the thinking we have today, under the GUISE of free thinking.
IF religion was false, then we would not have it, it would have never cultivated to these times, and ppl would NOT have died for such a sacrifice if it were not true.

Many died for GOD, by persecution.
This would NOT have ever been ...if it was false. There are many false things on earth...but none give the conviction and power as religion.

And the bible is like 6000 years old from the start. NOTHING has lasted as long, or has evoked more debate, controversy, feelings and power as religion.

It would have never occured had we just 'evolved' from nothing. Someone gave us the WORD. And it says in the bible, it shall always be...His word. It will go on for all ages...and so far...He is right. God has NOT penned the book by his own hand, only the covenant, which is the Ten Commandments.

BUT He said what to write...and being that the Holy Spirit is God, He worked thru His spirit, and thru His Word ....Jesus.

I won't give a change of heart to anyone. It is not my job, but I shall hope for all souls. And pray.

Okcity, I know plenty of folks, both who fought in the WW11 and Vietnam, and my husband's uncle is MIA from Vietnam....

I am NOT fighting becuase I am above the age, and I have 4 children. And as for you serving 14 years...were you at war?
Which war? Did you see things like the such we see today?

You served, but did you fight?

Who am I? WHO ARE YOU??
This war is not the same as Vietnam.....not by a long shot.
Vietnam was us acting on behalf of another weaker nations civil war. We lost, but had we won, would we have been viewed better?

This war is NOT about oil, or the prices of oil would not be so extra~ordinary. And this war is ABOUT terrorism that has been infiltrating the nations of the world for a number of years...and 911 being one of the worst of their attacks.

I am not sitting here saying how it a wrongful war....just because you believe it is.

If this war was Clinton's war....and he did set it aflame in 1998 when he threw some bombs in where the terrorists were ....but went no further...

BUT is this was a war during his office, you would be singing another tune.

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The lie is in the thinking we have today, under the GUISE of free thinking.

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I think we arre talking about different things . . .
1) if they had truly taught the way as life to live rather than His being God, who will justify your sins. Then the emphesis would have been on the life, not on the acceptablity of the lifestyle.
2) if they had trusted in GOD rather than obsuring the truth, they would have promoted (teaching) understanding the truth.
3) even the early churches, the apostles had problems with 'the love of money' amongits other problems, they had to address . . . what was formost importance to the church of the middle ages?
Teaching of Christ or resurrection of the Empire (society)?

The first people to come to the new world, did they come to teach GOD's love or did they come for their own interest?
Then look at the thread about the UN. Do we really seek to live at peace with our brothers & sisters, filled with love & compassion helping them to find the truth?
Do you see a reflection of Jesus in the doings of Mother Threasa? Does 'Christianity hold that same reflection?
This nation sure as hell doesn't. but we accept the Lie being put before Christ because we hope they will come to know the Truth?
Is it not written 'Except someone teach them . . .'
but to do that one must live in the Truth?

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Vietnam was us acting on behalf of another weaker nations civil war.

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Sorry to tell you this but (a) it was about cutting off the food supply to China so that those UN sanctions would be more effective. (b) most of those people (those poor huddled masses) had no idea what democracy, capitalism or communism was, let alone why all these insane people were running around destroying their crops, homes & lives.

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BUT is this was a war during his office, you would be singing another tune.

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No, I would still be saying 'seek & ye shall find' so if you want peace, you have to seek it. War hasn't done that yet so maybe we should try living in peace & helping others for change?
What to hell, crazy as it sounds may be Jesus (the lifestyle) really is the Way?

Patrish - the point is you are no more of a patriot then I am. I love this country, I support the troops. When you join the military you give up your constitutional rights (which I could never really understand) and become subject to the UCMJ (Uniform code of military justice). In short, that means that you are the property of Uncle sam, and uncle sam can order you to die or take another persons life and your only reply is yes sir. But you do this only to protect the constitution from foreign and domestic enemies. I don't believe we needed to go to Iraq, we thought that there was a threat to our constitution but now know that there was none. We have killed over 6,000 Iraqis and 600 U.S. soldiers have died so far. AND THERE WAS NO THREAT. Somebody has to think about these soldiers who have to say yes sir. That's me, because I've made that sacrifice, and I know what it means.

This is becoming just another brick in the wall. Hitler convinced a whole nation that Jews were less then human and almost wiped them out. Some religious movement who thinks we need to make ready for the return of Christ thinks its perfectly ok to kill Muslims.

Explain it to me one more time - because I still don't get it.

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Jesus (the lifestyle) really is the Way?

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A born again Bush is preventing the UN from taking hold of Babalon where the Anti Christ will rule. (ya right) and you think Jesus approves of this? Do you think waging war is following Jesus.

You won't listen to me, listen to cturtle - luckily I was never ask to kill another person, and I hurt for all those who are asked to do this. It would be easier for them if they were actually fighting to protect their homeland.

[It would have never occured had we just 'evolved' from nothing.]

I beg to differ. Islam evolved from Christianity. Christianity evolved from Judeism. Judeism evolved from paganism. Paganism evolved from mans ignorance of the workings of nature, life, and death.
And by the way, do you know where the 10 Commandments evolved from? They were quite similar to the law codes of Urukagina of Lagash, some 1000 years earlier. And ironically, this was in present day Iraq!!!!

I don't know what came first paganism or hinduism. Paganism I think is like protestant. If you're not a part of an organized religion, you must be pagan. My wife gets into pagan stuff. Most of the traditions we have today are pagan with a Christian twist added to it. It's a nature based religion. If you ever delve deep into the natural world you will find it a bit magical. My wife grew up living off the land without electricity or running water. Throw away the structure and you will learn of the container it came in.

OK, you're starting to disappoint me. Haven't you read anything I've written before?

Polytheism, or paganism, is the belief in many gods. Monotheism is the belief in one god. Hinduism is a form of monotheism, and its roots can be traced back somewhere around 1000 BC. Paganism can be traced backed to the time of the Sumerians and the Egyptians around 6000 BC. If you count the Neanderthals, well since they had no bible, I'd assume they were pagans.