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Suns Boiling, and Black Holes Freezing…

User Thread
 43yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Black Gold is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Suns Boiling, and Black Holes Freezing…
Please correct me if I'm wrong…

I think it is interesting to note that although Suns boil matter, and the effect is often that you would separate substances until you have purer substances (in Elemental form at least)…
However, other elements are born in the process. Perhaps this is because the Suns split the atoms, and they reform. Helium may be produced by two Hydrogen atoms splitting and reforming in pairs, and so on…

But what of extreme cold. What comes to mind is Black Holes…
If heat splits matter up, perhaps extreme cold would do something similar…
What could be happening is that, again atoms spilt this time from a similar process of pressure (this time produced by the great contraction involved with freezing)…
Perhaps the substances, that enter extreme cold, end up being patched together. For example consider a cup of water with ice-cubes in it, then placed into a freezer. All the substance ends up patching together…

Either way you look at it, extremes would appear to have similar qualities. Those qualities being the ability to split atoms, and then from there being able to reform atomic fractals into higher or smaller substances…

I am not sure I have got this correct…
But if correct, one thing to consider would be that extreme heat and cold may be able to produce a different element from that which entered into is influence. Also that extreme heat may produce a different element from what extreme cold may…

One thing to consider is the special qualities of elements…
Two things that come to mind are:-
- That water expands as it becomes Solid and Gas, whereas all other substances expand in Gaseous form and contract when becoming Solid.
- That some elements have a half-life and are prone to becoming other substances, without the great need for extremes of temperature.

Please register your comments, if you've seen this idea before, or if you have some insights into the thread…

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"There is no negative one..."
 30yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Sanity101 is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
The existance of black holes is questionable at best.
And if they did exist. They'd be almost like polar opposites.
The sun smashes atoms together but black holes rip them appart.

You said.
"Either way you look at it, extremes would appear to have similar qualities. Those qualities being the ability to split atoms, and then from there being able to reform atomic fractals into higher or smaller substances…"

I think your trying to say that using the extreme cold you could make new elements. Correct? If so. There is a similar theory.

The tempeture is called Absolute Zero. This is the tempature at which. All atomic motion stops. "Supposedly" But yes this is only theory. And if all atomic motion just stoped then we could create any element we wanted because we could attach pieces of matter like lego building blocks.

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 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
I think it is interesting to note that although Suns boil matter, and the effect is often that you would separate substances until you have purer substances (in Elemental form at least)…
However, other elements are born in the process. Perhaps this is because the Suns split the atoms, and they reform. Helium may be produced by two Hydrogen atoms splitting and reforming in pairs, and so on…

Actually I think the present theory is that the intense heat & pressure within the sun causes the atomic particles to exist in a flux which doesn't maintain the aspect of individual atoms => elements, just a theory man has devised to account the temperature & pressure produced by the existence of the mass & energy of the sun.
quote:
The existence of black holes is questionable at best.
And if they did exist. They'd be almost like polar opposites.

The dark matter or black holes are theorized to account for the apparent gravitational forces existing where no apparent gravitational (large inertial mass) body exist? To account for the gravitational curvature of space => another supposition might extend that gravitational constant isn't as constant as we tend to believe but then that would throw the whole galaxatic perception into the file 13 (trash bin). These theories developed to explain descrepencies between observed & theoritical values based upon known values.

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 30yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Sanity101 is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Yes, however i agree with tesla when he stated "Who can something act on nothing." Thats why i dont think gravity warps space at all. I mean my mind can totally be perswaded either way if presented evidence but i have seen no evidence that conclusively proves that space itself is in fact curved. I mean it's literally just that empty space.

I think Einstein's theory is so famous because it just sparked a interest on this subject. However I guess this subject cant be debated conclusively anyway because it's precicely that. Theory.

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 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
I think I know what you mean, to an extent space is a void & therefore isn't curved at all. What we generally call space is more technically the E-M field that are related to matter.
PS. Thanks for bringing it up though because it started me thinking about E-M fields & how they would use a magnet & iron filings to show the lines of force . . . wonder why they tend to form lines & not a field?

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[  Edited by Wayback at   ]
 30yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Sanity101 is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Iv'e got no clue.
However, I do allot of different of experiments with magnets
and almost have a successful mag motor. A couple more months of tweeking and ill have it. lol, Fascinating stuff though physics. It's like physical philosophy. Amazes the crap out of me.

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 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
I think Einstein's theory is so famous because it just sparked a interest on this subject. However I guess this subject can't be debated conclusively anyway because it's precisely that. Theory.
Hmm . . .
quote:
Theory of Relativity . . If one reference system exist to another reference system then the the (laws) values of physics exist & are relative to both (all) reference systems that exist relative to it?
then the reference system of our macro existence exist & is relative to the reference system of the atoms which compose our existence. In fact we find they are mutually relavent [sp: relativist] to both (all) reference systems.
quote:
sp: relativism n. any theory of knowledge, truth, morality, etc., holding the criteria of judgment (the mathematical relationship) may vary with individuals (reference systems) & their environments

The biggest problem with understanding physics is not understanding that they deal with different reference systems that exist relative to each other but the values are related by the environmental relationships of the reference system.

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 68yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that cturtle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Ya, I think I know what you mean?
A brother Jon wanted to run electric & water out on his land to provide utilitiy connections for a family gatherings. I was just helping run a couple of 3/4 inch pipes underground to provide separate service conduit for water & electric.
Jon's father was a plumber so he knows about running water but he had different opinions from his brother, who is an electrician. If the water was used as the medium to transfer power then Jon would have a better understanding of the electrical applications. So even though the flow of water & the flow of electricity are different & separate aspects of existence, they both obey fundalmental principles common to their existence. Although the electric lines are insulated, they produce electric fields that extend & induce voltage (current) in other electric lines & in the water contained within it's conduit.

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"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."
[  Edited by cturtle at   ]
 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
I am not sure what it is you are trying to say? Other than the principles of particle (Newtonian) physics & those of wave (electromagnetic) have coexisted from the beginning. That man developed the use of the sling, etc which are or could be related to observed behavior based on instinct.
Timing the release of the sling to cast the stone accurately, striking the ball with a bat or club provide a basic understanding that provides for the analytical analysis of particles. Where as we don't these instinctual perceptions of wave theory to provide an analytical analysis?

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 68yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that cturtle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
I think it is interesting to note that although Suns boil matter, and the effect is often that you would separate substances until you have purer substances (in Elemental form at least)… what of extreme cold.
Matter is neither created nor destroyed . . . it is only changed in form
or is that law: Energy is neither created nor destroyed , it is only changed in Form ?
So just what does 'change in form' mean? Water exist in various forms, ice [solid], water [liquid], humidity [gaseous], steam [plasma] and because they represent different forms or levels of energy. So they represent a natural sequence, like action-reaction?
quote:
What comes to mind is Black Holes… If heat splits matter up, perhaps extreme cold would do something similar… process of pressure (this time produced by the great contraction involved with freezing)…
Either way you look at it, extremes would appear to have similar qualities.
Science seems to think that the sun as being under intense pressure because of its' inertial mass.
quote:
The tempeture is called Absolute Zero. This is the tempature at which. All atomic motion stops. "Supposedly" But yes this is only theory.
I was taking a photograph in Mc Intosh the other day. I asked a local resident about taking a photograph & we started talking as I set up the camera & took meter readings to set the exposure. I also measured the distance between the lens & the backplate {film plane}.
Noting the proceedure he asked about the measurement.
quote:
Ah, I compare this length to the focal length of the lens. If it is greater then I need to addition exposure to composate for the inverse square of distance for the falling off light.
Wonder if phemonia of black holes is more related to the aspects of the tool (light) than what is being observed?
Could it be that our own existense, the matter & fields manifest the effect of a lens through which we form our view?

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"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."
[  Edited by cturtle at   ]
 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
If heat splits matter up, perhaps extreme cold would do something similar… process of pressure ...extremes would appear to have similar qualities.

Yes but some compounds exist as a gas in fact some require low temperature & high pressure to exist as a liquid or solid?
quote:
So just what does 'change in form' mean?

temperature measure of heat energy; measured bonding energy & the energy of motion of molecules?
Electro-Magnetic or Charged Particles
Special on the electron microscope using electromagnetic fields to confine electrons to illuminate into the microscopic nature of our being. Ya, the cathode ray tube is it, electromagnetic radiation or negatively charged particles?

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[  Edited by Wayback at   ]
 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
Wonder if phenomenon of black holes is more related to the aspects of the tool (light) than what is being observed?
Could it be that our own existence, the matter & fields manifest the effect of a lens through which we form our view?
Yes, it is a strange coincidence that at the molecule (particle) aspect increase of energy corresponds to increase in (volume) size while emission of photon corresponds to frequency increase in size? But I duly note that the 'vacuum of space' is not the void we tend to believe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meteorite
http://www.solarviews.com/eng/meteor.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asteroid

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 68yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that cturtle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Photon emission results from electrons in thier orbitals extending as energy increases till they finally drop back to their original or lower energy configuration by the emission of a photon (e-m energy). So you are saying higher frequency must represent a larger (longer) transition to a lower level?

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"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."
 40yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wayback is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
higher frequency must represent a larger (longer) transition
No, heating or increasing the energy level results in a broad spectrum of photon emission. In fact, they found that photon emission could be achieved at lower energy by applying particular (resonant) frequencies. This lead to chemical analysis by varying the frequency at lower energy levels which did not break the chemical bonds.

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 68yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that cturtle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Anyway as I was saying, so I let this guy look under the dark cloth at [focus screen] that Iwas setting up to shoot. He was thinking about getting into LF photography & the normal responce 'How can you get used to looking at everything inverted like that ', I think he would stick with a single lens reflex [35mm] camera.
As you can see from the photo, LF cameras are the old fashion type of camera.



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"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."
Suns Boiling, and Black Holes Freezing…
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