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Why Question God's Existence - Page 2

User Thread
 35yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that etherealmeekle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
Would you recieve a spanking for calling your parents liars when they tell you Santa and the Easter bunny aren't real, or just for questioning them if Jesus and their equally claimed and unaccountable God is?


This has no relevance. God doesn't punish people for questioning Him, He punishes those who reject Him. I question God all the time, sometimes I outright challenge Him because I have a desire for answers and He provides them for me without being angered by my insolence. But if I chose to deny Him and lived a life against Him he would most definitely punish me for that behaviour.

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"Speak out, even if what you have to say is unpopular"
 43yrs • M
A CTL of 1 means that Ironwood is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
You miss the point completely, who is God and how do you know him or his desires?

Let me answer you for you, for I'm fairly certain you will answer incorrectly.

You know what others have told, taught, and or even threatened you with.

Then most likely, like so many others here and elsewhere have, you searched inside of yourself and found what you felt right and agreeable with and called it your own meeting of God.

This is what any and every good salesmen and politician does, they tell you something that makes obvious sense, you agree with it, then you decide you can trust them and buy whatever they are selling.

Beware those who call upon your trust and faith in your God to make you believe what they are saying.

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"The Greatest Enemy of Knowledge is Not Ignorance, It is the ILLUSION of Knowledge. Stephen Hawking"
 35yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that etherealmeekle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
My belief is not based on anybody's words. For this reason I will not simply agree with you unless you can show me more than God has. My belief is based on my questions to God, I have asked and he has answered. As I mentioned in a previous post I have asked of other deities to show their power and none other than God has given me any response.

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"Speak out, even if what you have to say is unpopular"
 43yrs • M
A CTL of 1 means that Ironwood is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
(this was intended in my last post)

The point of this is, rejecting God, or other's interpretation of him?

quote:
My belief is based on my questions to God, I have asked and he has answered. As I mentioned in a previous post I have asked of other deities to show their power and none other than God has given me any response.



Would you be so kind as to share? Personal experience and proof are the least heard but most relevant stories.

However, do you or do you not follow an organized religion?

Either way, if you are going to argue your posistion, please enlighten us as to what that posistion is, as you are now calling it unique and of your own singular experience. I would like to know when I speak to the man who speaks to God, and what God has to say about things.

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"The Greatest Enemy of Knowledge is Not Ignorance, It is the ILLUSION of Knowledge. Stephen Hawking"
 35yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that etherealmeekle is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Christianity is much more than most people realise, it is not about rules and traditions but rather about having a relationship with God through Jesus Christ and we do this with the power of the Holy Spirit. When I have been in need God has given me what I needed. I have seen God at work through the subtleties of day to day life but this is something that is hard to convey because most people will automatically reject it. But I am not just spouting off nonsense you can experience God's presence if you open up to Him. I didn't really believe in it until I saw for myself but now I have seen so much that it would be impossible for me to try to deny it. I simply ask questions until the answers were plain as black and white. I suspect this will not be much help to you but if you seek out God and question Him you will come to the same conclusion.

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"Speak out, even if what you have to say is unpopular"
 43yrs • M
A CTL of 1 means that Ironwood is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
Christianity is much more than most people realise


Again, you should keep this in mind as well.

quote:
it is not about rules and traditions but rather about having a relationship with God through Jesus Christ and we do this with the power of the Holy Spirit.


In the most innocent and naive interpretation of the specific religion of Christianity, this would be correct, but unfortunately, your far more profound initial point as quoted makes it simply not the case.

Thankfully you seem to be embracing and making the most of the best things that Christianity has to offer, at least in your description of it here. Though elsewhere you have indulged in the negativity and control you claim to be against.

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"The Greatest Enemy of Knowledge is Not Ignorance, It is the ILLUSION of Knowledge. Stephen Hawking"
 34yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that summit is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
it is not about rules and traditions but rather about having a relationship with God through Jesus Christ


But isn't the relationship with God through Jesus governed via many rules and traditions? i.e- 10 commandments

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"The summit is just a halfway point"
 45yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that PeteSmith is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
The relationship with God is one of unconditional love.

I assume Summitsolo that you are not married (judging by your age). Take this for example: If I do things my wife wants me to do because I have to (i.e. out of duty) rather than I want to (because I love her) then dare I say my marriage would be not a very happy one.

We choose to follow Gods commands because we love and respect him and we realise that his "commandments" are for our good. If he really is the one who created us then wouldnt it make sense that he would be the only one who knows what will make us happy.

If we get a new gadget that we have no idea how to use and if we try to figure out how this gadet works without refering to the manufacturers manual, we will either end up abusing the gadget (i.e not using it as intended) or we will break it.

The Bible is the manual for the human being given to us by God (the manufacturer). If we ignore it we will end up missing what our purpose is and ultimately we will end up destroying ourselves!



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""What we do in life echoes in eternity" Maximus"
 37yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that heyjme1 is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
If it makes you happy so be; I personally think I am not that niave or faithful, whichever word suits best, to believe in the Bible. If the Bible is a manual; I never read manuals anyway becuase to me learning is about experimentation; if you do everything by the book you merely act out what has already been set; a) this rejects individuality and b) you never really understand you just have active information.

Compare two sportsmen: one is natural and has taught himself with some guidance. The other has just learned straight from the textbook. The former is human and better to watch; the latter may as well be a robot.

If you can't question and lead by blind faith the experiences you feel mean nothing beyond just fact; one of which is happiness. So if you feel good then that's good. I just cant buy into it. I simply can't-it is me to question.


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""No words""
 48yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Methuzula is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Some are sure there is no God. Others are sure there is a God. Then there are those willing to entertain the debate.

To question the existence of the Supreme Being we are actually questioning the nature of our own existence, (as usual seeking to satisfy some selfish desire).

But if there is a Supreme Being, (from any faith tradition), then life is not chaos its a structured ordered existence, a design, wherein everything/one is made with a definite specific "purpose".

Whether they are of the faithful or of the "godless", people with a "Sense of purpose" tend to be driven towards accomplishments which fullfill it and effectively define their "place" in society.

Except in cases of self delusion, one's "purpose" is consistent with their, (actual not imagined), self-image and self-esteem.

Whether it is self defined or "adopted" from an organized religon "purpose" appears to be just an extension of the human ego, generated out of a desire to be seen, recognized, acknowledged, affirmed, etc. ...

So any discussion of God and His existence, (as with most things human), appears to be a purely selfish enterprise undertaken with a "what do I have to do" and a "what's in it for me" attitude.

Can anyone being honest truly claim that Self-satisfaction is not the catalyst for the vast majority of human activity? Is it any wonder that religous law is so heavily focused on our treatment of our fellow-man?

When questioned in the scriptures as to what was the greatest of the Commandments, Jesus answered them saying; Love thy neighbor as thyself.

With so much dillution of the original texts over time, the context where we find any wisdom has been tuned to the theme of self-gratification of some kind.

All religon does is redefine what is self gratifying, because of this followers can derrive pleasure and happiness even from martyrdom.

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"You are affected by 3 generations and you affect 3 generations, and every third generation a major change takes place in the family."
 43yrs • M
A CTL of 1 means that Ironwood is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
The Bible is the manual for the human being given to us by God (the manufacturer). If we ignore it we will end up missing what our purpose is and ultimately we will end up destroying ourselves!



Do not confuse belief with factual reality.

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"The Greatest Enemy of Knowledge is Not Ignorance, It is the ILLUSION of Knowledge. Stephen Hawking"
[  Edited by Ironwood at   ]
 34yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that summit is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:
The Bible is the manual for the human being given to us by God (the manufacturer). If we ignore it we will end up missing what our purpose is and ultimately we will end up destroying ourselves!


I've ignored the bible, but that hasn't stopped me missing my purpose to life. This generally applies to the other 4.5 billion people who aren't christians. As the way I see it, christians such as you, need a supreme being and the bible to guide your passage through life rather than take your own course in life- to live through natural experimental learning. The essence to life for me, has been well described by heyjme1. To me, life shouldn't be defined as having an ultimate purpose. You can still lead a diverse, full-filling happy life without a bible as a guide to complete or satisfy a relationship with 'god' as a purpose to life.


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"The summit is just a halfway point"
 45yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that PeteSmith is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:

Do not confuse belief with factual reality.



What is factual reality?

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""What we do in life echoes in eternity" Maximus"
 45yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that PeteSmith is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
quote:

I've ignored the bible, but that hasn't stopped me missing {I assume this was supposed to be 'finding'} my purpose to life



and

quote:

life shouldn't be defined as having an ultimate purpose



Your two statements seem to contradict each other.
You may not admit this in this discussion but the reason you are in this chat room is because you are searching for a reason for your existance. Why do we spend billions of dollars each year sending probes and funding SETI programs if we are not searching for the reason for our existance.

Until we can find what we were created for we will never fully know our purpose!

The Bible has basically been rejected not because it has been tried and found wanting but rather it has be found difficult and left untried!!



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""What we do in life echoes in eternity" Maximus"
 37yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that heyjme1 is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Ultimately, if we were absolutely pedantic, there is no factual reality.
However, there is factual reality in terms of we as people have made so many things from our principles in science. The computer, your seat, everything which is not 'natural' around you came from principles of science or art or imagination. The fact is those principles work-the computer was made for its designed intentions so there is some factual reality.

Now of course the accuracy of these things working lies in the ability to predict what will happen based upon current understanding: proof's in the pudding. I have faith this computer will work in the next minute.

I'm really gibbering about common sense: but that needs to be reinforced so often in philosophical debate!

Now there are soft and hard sciences. The former are more open to debate. Things like evolutionsim and creationism. It is the intention oif the mind when fearful to but all the things unknown into a box and stamp God on it so we can carry on as we are and be happy. However, as long as one is rational it will be ok to delve into unknown things.

To go into the spirit realm for example. Lets say people have an out of body experience when they temporarily die and are resuccatated. Some people claim to be able to see their corporeal form from outside their own body. Now one 'rational' test for this would be to see if they could see objects that they would not be able to see from where they were lying in corporeal form. Such as a glass vase on a shelf above. This is rational thinking and lets not dwell into the I know nothing- it may be pedantically correct but if we want freedom ask the question: what do I not know: where do I find the answers. Thats inquistion. It needs faith as a guide though to get anywhere purposeful.

Oh....two minutes later and the computer is still working....miracle! LOL

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""No words""
Why Question God's Existence - Page 2
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