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I am saddened by the situation in the courts

User Thread
 53yrs • F •
A CTL of 1 means that Patrish is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
I am saddened by the situation in the courts
http://tinyurl.com/3wqwa

IF you look at the pic, you will see a very alert Terri Schiavo...and she is indeed very beautiful.

The pics we see of her on the TV, are a drug induced state in which her husband wishes us to see her.

What do you think??

Look at the link to see what she actually looks like.

How can we as a society not be crushed in our hearts to know...her life is meaningless to our judiciary system.

What merits the capacity of others to judge her life deemed inadmissable...so much so she is not even allowed to eat or hydrate?

Does she really seem vegetative to you?

I ask because this has caused me much sorrow.

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"Life is full of lemons, and the lemonade is sweet."
 51yrs • F •
chrysalys is new to Captain Cynic and has less than 15 posts. New members have certain restrictions and must fill in CAPTCHAs to use various parts of the site.
Terri Schiavo, is in no pain at this time, and she deserves the right to die. I do not believe that any judge, politician, including our esteemed President, or right to life group has the right to tell us when or how we can die. Our death is our god given right. George Bush has said that in situations like the Terri Shiavo case it is best to air on the side of life. My question for Mr.. Bush is how many comas or vegetative states has he been in.

I was injured when I fell off my skateboard in 1980. I had a blood clot the size of a softball on my brain. I was given surgery and my prognosis was either death or a persistent vegetative state. By an act of god I was spared even though my family was told that nothing could live with that type of pressure.
Having said that, I am an expert in this matter. Had I not recovered, I would not have wanted to be kept alive by a machine for years, possibly even decades.

Terri may have rudimentary brain activity, but she is gone. Her world is dark. There is no love, no joy, no sadness, no pain. There is nothing left that makes her human or alive except for the shell that is her body. If by some far reaching chance she does have the ability to think, she is being held hostage by her body.

It is time to take back control of our own bodies.
The legislation passed by congress (not by us) gives anyone the right to protest how and when we are allowed to die. Exactly how much control of our lives and deaths are we going to allow Big Brother to have.

Consider this: Tomorrow morning you are driving to work and you are hit by an oncoming car. Your brain is severely damaged...you are now Terri....15 years later your body is still alive. It could happen.

President Bush doesn't care about Terri,to my knowledge has never visited, has not help financially with her medical bills, and has no idea what he is talking about. He and other politicians in Florida are using this poor woman for their own political gain. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. Our president has absolutely no right to speak on her behalf or ours in these matters. Who in the hell does he think he is. He has the right to send us to war, to act as our leader with other countries, but he DOES NOT have the right to come into my life and tell me how or when I am allowed to die. That is between me and God.

Another point I would like to make is Mike is Terri's husband. He is the only one that should have the right to decide. Terri was an adult when she was injured and her parents rights were relinquished on her 18th birthday, and when she said I do. Her parents are fighting to keep her alive purely out of selfishness. True love is knowing when to let go. And allow your loved one peace and freedom.
We would not insert a feeding tube into a dog, and would probably be arrested for doing so, because we see that as cruelty to animals, but we will insert a feeding tube into our children. We would humanely administer a lethal injection to end the dogs suffering. We would not allow the animal to starve and dehydrate to death. We show a kindness to our pets we don't show to each other. Why is that?

If Terri were to wake today, the horror she would face would be unimaginable. 15 years have passed for one, Like a rock skipping on water, the world moved on without her, her hand has palsied, she is paralyzed, and she does not resemble the person she once was. Her cognitive ability would be and always would be nil.

I have faced that horror and stared it in the eye. It still effects me to this day. I woke and found myself imprisoned in a body that I did not recognize, I was a hostage in my own body l. I could not understand for many years what had happened to me. It was a nightmare. But I recovered. It was a fluke but I was an 11 year old child, she is a 41 year old woman, her Neurosynapses will not reconnect as they did with me due to her age. The amount of brain damage she has, there is just no possible way for her to heal, and by the way she has been like this for so long that IF she were to ever recover it would have happened years ago. The only reason she has been kept alive so long is because we can. We can keep a person physically alive for decades, but should we?

I urge every one to have a written directive stating exactly what measures you will allow. It is so sad that in this day and age we must do this, but if you do not have a Living Will this very same thing could happen to you at any given moment and there is nothing your loved ones can do to stop it.
I urge you to send this to everyone on your list, keep this going, we can make a change.

We are making too many people live today thru extraordinary measures. And governing personal choice.
It is time for the American People to take back control of our bodies from our government. It is time to STAND.

George Bush works for us not the other way around, he is our employee, and it's not his decision to make. We tell him what to do, and he has to act on our behalf. Time to put him in his place and to clarify his job description. He has stepped over the line this time. I urge you to be outraged and let him know about it. Just give him a call. I'm sure he would love to hear from you.

E-mail, phone, or write George Bush at:

The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue NW
Washington, DC 20500

president@whitehouse.gov

202-456-1414
fax: 202-456-2461
http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/

TTY/TDD

Comments: 202-456-6213

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 55yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that TheIrishPagan is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Since I do not know this woman personally, I will not have the audacity to make my own decision concerning this. I will say that the government has no business sticking their little fingers in a person's life like this though. It may sound cold or unfeeling, but no one who is not directly involved in this dire situation really has a right to interfere in any way.

As for it happening to me, I have a living will.

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"Oops, it appears I have run over your dogma with my karma."
 53yrs • F •
A CTL of 1 means that Patrish is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
First review the picture of this woman today!!!!
click here
http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/images/2005/05031405.jpg

Here is her story...

Recovered 'Vegetative State' Patient Kate Adamson Speaks Before Schiavo Rally
Withdrawal of food and water was 'one of the most painful experiences you can imagine'


CLEARWATER, FL., March 14, 2005 (LifeSiteNews.com) - On Saturday a rally of over three-hundred of Terri Schiavo's most die-hard supporters heard the first-hand account of the sufferings and remarkable recovery of Kate Adamson. Struck down in 1995 at the age of thirty-three by a rare double brainstem stroke, Kate, then a mother of two young girls, was completely paralyzed; she was unable even to blink her eyes. Like Terri Schiavo, the medical staff treating her questioned the merit of continuing granting Kate the most basic human right of food and water.

Terri Schiavo, although not nearly as severely disabled as Adamson once appeared to be, is slotted to have her feeding tube removed at 1:00 pm this Friday. Similarly, Kate Adamson's feeding tube was at one point removed for a full eight days before being reinserted due to the intervention of her husband (also a competent lawyer).

Frequently described by medical authorities as a humane way to die, Kate - now as vibrant and beautiful as before her stroke - testified before the crowd of Terri's family and supporters that this form of legalized execution was 'one of the most painful experiences you can imagine." Unable to respond or to indicate awareness, Kate Adamson asserts, 'I was just like Terri...but I was alive! I could hear every word. They were saying 'shall we just not treat her?'...I suffered excruciating misery in silence.'

This personal testimony confirms what Terri supporters have long suspected-that the execution sought by her husband Michael Schiavo is anything but painless and humane. Furthermore, Kate's remarkable recovery to nearly full mental and physical health--she still suffers partial paralysis of her left side--gives Terri supporters hope that Terri too may still experience a similar recovery, if granted proper care and treatment.

During her early-afternoon speech Kate declared that 'If they want to kill Terri they should have the guts to put a gun to her head' rather than condemn her to such a slow and painful death. She finished off by summing up the full import of the Schiavo case, saying, 'The measure of a society is how they treat the least of us. Life is sacred or meaningless, there is nothing in between.'

Contact Kate Adamson by visiting http://www.katesjourney.com
__________________

http://www.lifesite.net/ldn/2005/mar/05031408.html


WHOEVER SAYS SHE DOES NOT FEEL IT IS COMPLETELY IGNORANT TO HOW NERVES AND ORGANS WORK....OR THEY ARE DECEPTIVE.


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"Life is full of lemons, and the lemonade is sweet."
 33yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Angelfire is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
"WHOEVER SAYS SHE DOES NOT FEEL IT IS COMPLETELY IGNORANT TO HOW NERVES AND ORGANS WORK....OR THEY ARE DECEPTIVE."
Her brain is mush, how can she feel?

Oh wait, you're probably a brain surgeon.

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"Durch Nacht und Blut das Licht"
 53yrs • F •
A CTL of 1 means that Patrish is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
EVEN the 'definition' of a complete persistent vegetative state says that the person can feel pain, and will wince away from it.

SO, Doc...whats your medical degree?

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"Life is full of lemons, and the lemonade is sweet."
 36yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wyote is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
seems like everyone has to have an opinion of this woman. so, i guess ill BS one myself. it would be very easy for her husband to simply divorce her and let her family take care of her, but i think he obviously knows things about her that she never chose to share with her family... happens all the time. if it is Gods will, she will snap out of her vegitative state before starving to death. otherwise, she should be allowed to die with peace and dignity.

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"A loving heart is the beginning of all knowledge. - Thomas Carlyle"
 33yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Angelfire is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Patrish - The woman is unaware of everything, she doesn't have the ability to have a coherent thought.

Given this, I think its unlikely she can feel pain. Though admitedly, she can't tell us if she feels pain can she? Certainly people with PVS don't actually react to anything, and certainly not pain.

Is she alive? Her mind is gone, she is no longer human, let us put the poor woman to rest. We don't have to degrade her by zombifying her body.

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"Durch Nacht und Blut das Licht"
 43yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that wizardslogic is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
If only it could be proven so. Unfortunately, the question as to whether Terry is cognizant of the world around her, including the sensation pain, can never be proven either way. This question is very much like the question as to whether a fetus is 'consciously' human or not. We can never be sure what's going on inside of the mind of this woman and, for that reason, I do not believe she should be starved to death. I personally believe the human mind is seperate from the physical, material brain. I think of the physical brain as "prism" or bridge of communication between the human mind and the external world. It is a tool which can be damaged, making one's interpretation of data from the external world difficult. Subsequently, one's interpretation of data from such a damaged tool results in erratic and erroneous behavior which to others would seem indicative of a person who has lost thier intellectual capacities. Yet the mind, I believe, remains intact, unable to correctly communicate with the external world. Unfortunately, this view cannot be proven either. I still do not believe anyone should be allowed to establish as fact the "vegetative" mental state of anyone.

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"Each conscious mind is alone in the universe!"
 43yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that wizardslogic is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Besides, we do not know what Terry wanted, only what her husband says she wanted. We do not know if she thinks. We do not know if those smiles she gives her mother when spoken to with loving caresses are genuine expressions of emotion. We do not know if she would want to live. We do not know.

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"Each conscious mind is alone in the universe!"
 33yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Angelfire is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
Perhaps, though it has been fairly conclusively argued that she did not want to be in this state. She would rather die. Its not like the husband has anything to gain by her death. He isn't paying the medical bill, he could divorce her and shed responsibility if he wished. I think his assertion that she didn't want to be a zombie is candid enough.

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"Durch Nacht und Blut das Licht"
 51yrs • F •
chrysalys is new to Captain Cynic and has less than 15 posts. New members have certain restrictions and must fill in CAPTCHAs to use various parts of the site.
During her early-afternoon speech Kate declared that 'If they want to kill Terri they should have the guts to put a gun to her head' rather than condemn her to such a slow and painful death.

This I absolutely agree with this, a lethal injection on Friday would have been the most humane way to let her go. As far as the person that started this thread, until you have walked a mile in my shoes, I don't believe you would ever understand. And yes one woman woke up, but she had to endure a suffering that is undouptedly horrifying. And IF by some tiny chance Terri can think, (of which she cannot) how many decades should we allow her to be imprisoned by her own body.
I have been held hostage inside my body. I can attest that that horror is worse than death. Inside a body that I didn't recognize as my own, and unable to tell anyone that I was there.
My imprissonment lasted a short time...Terri has had a life sentence.
"God forbid you ever had to walk a mile in her shoes
'Cause then you really might know what it's like to have to loose"
Everlast "What it's like"

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 51yrs • F •
chrysalys is new to Captain Cynic and has less than 15 posts. New members have certain restrictions and must fill in CAPTCHAs to use various parts of the site.
Oh and so the starter of this thread can become an expert. I suggest a hammer to your temple. It's gonna hurt like hell. But if you want what I got you gotta do what I did.
Take a walk in my shoes...
It's ok, after the first initial blow, it's light out...see ya in 15 years

P.S. my injury was to the right side of my brain I still can't feel my left foot or hand. So it's the right temple. I suggest getting it right the first time eh. It would be a bitch to have to hit yourself a second time.

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 55yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that TheIrishPagan is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
I do three-day fasts every couple of years; I couldn't begin to imagine starving to death.

But what really gets me is that the media has literally concentrated on this one woman, almost to the exclusion of everything else. Yes, it is despicable, but there are millions dying every day around the world. There are children who go days without eating, abroad and here in the US.

I say, enough is enough, let the family deal with this travesty in private, and allow them some friggin' dignity.

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"Oops, it appears I have run over your dogma with my karma."
 36yrs • M •
A CTL of 1 means that Wyote is a contributing member of Captain Cynic.
for the record, i would love nothing more than her to be given under the care of her family (parents). life is the most precious and sacred thing, even if she is a "vegitable" she is still alive, in some manner.

yet still, it makes no sense to me why her husband would go to all this trouble unless he had very good reason. i dont see any sort of motive for him to want to kill her.

a lethal injection would be much more humane, but thats an entirely new debate in itself.

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"A loving heart is the beginning of all knowledge. - Thomas Carlyle"
I am saddened by the situation in the courts
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