Vietnam Veterans

Vietnam Veterans [+ favourites]

The soldiers of the past speak up about their experiences and observations on current events.

http://calltoconscience.net/

"Hating everyone protects me from elitism."

Yet another sighting of stupidity, and ignorance.
I understand that they got dealt a bad hand from when they came back from the war but that page is mire anger from a person that no linger likes what his country dose.
Pure opinions from one side of the tracks.

"Emotions are for the weak minded, so cry me a river build a bridge and get over it."

shadowcult
Ya just a little tale of from a 'mire anger' disallusions of the past. Sitting in flight room really don't remember how or why, when a young Officer enters loudly proclaiming his deeds. Listening to him ramble on about his kill I begin to wonder if he is high? Oh, how glorious were the flames, bright orange reach into the sky as the napalm wiped the jungle from the eye and a thousand men lost their life.
Ya listening to this guy raving as he did I became angry with his lack of respect for human life. So I stood up before him and told him that he should brag on his serving his country but not on taking human life. He stopped in mid sentence and just stared at me in disbelieve. A kindly major callled to me and escorted me out side quietly he said to me, ' have compassion, all to soon the glory of the moment will fade and the realization of his act will haunt the night that fills his room.' That major was a really nice guy, I mean I was enlisted and way out of my league but he was good hearted about it.
Ya, they say the good die young, the major's life ended when he collided with his jet with a SV prop job.
WAR IS HELL, DON'T FORGET IT SO LEARN FROM PAST MISTAKES. Then maybe you won't have to make them yourself if you can learn from mine.

"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."

The page's arguments fall apart here : "Contrast this with the horrendous results of the U.S. led economic sanctions."
Its true the sanctions cost lives, but it was the only peaceful way to hurt Sadam. In fact, they are right in saying the sanctions were wrong, but what was the alternative? Letting Sadam strengthen himself in Irak unfettered?
The policy in Irak was broken, the sanctions were wrong and letting Saddam rebuild his strength, unthinkable.
Thus Bush launched Desert Storm II, featuring a flawless campaign, pathetic diplomacy and laughable arguments for war.

Nonetheless, the consequences for this diplomatic failure which was DS2 will most likely have good consequences and almost certainly better consequences then if the sanctions had continued.
I sympathize with the Veterans, but this a very complex issue and though Bush has near-obvious shady motives, Irak will turn out better for the war.

"Durch Nacht und Blut das Licht"

I always suggest those that have an optimistic view of Iraq to research the Palestine conflict.

Most people who oppose the war (intelligently) are well aware that completely alien occupations of foreign countries in a world saturated with terrorism can yield no positive results.

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/bodycount.htm

As you can see if you skim through the large page people are dying every single day in Iraq. I don't necessarily believe that this article is entirely correct, but they do provide information on their sources as well as a "Reported Minimum" and "Reported Maximum". I therefore believe it is somewhat correct, and the incidences are probably correct even if the number of killed are not.

I've said it before and I'll say it again... our nature of assuming the world is working the same way our media reports it is completely unfounded. You don't see every news channel reporting children dying... not because it isn't happening but because of irresponsible reporting.

We're more interested in Ben and JLo.

"Hating everyone protects me from elitism."

I am remiinded that when Clinton lied and tried to decieve the people, what an uproar it caused. People were talking impeachment proceeding and everything. So it may seem funny thing to wonder about the truth.
Decius, you being Canadian and pretty well informed just about what did Bush lie or rather what is the truth that he has obsured from our sight. When the Canadians released that suspected terrorist at our border was it because our intelligency agents wanted to observe what and who he contacted? Is it possible that 9/11 may have been actions set into motion by these agencies? I wonder just what is the truth, not that it is important or has any value?
Edit: Decius link was indeed an informative site. Thanks

"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."
[  Edited by cturtle at   ]

I have kept myself away from current events so I don't know about that terrorist being released.

But there is lots of speculation about whether the US had prior knowledge about 9/11.

Apparently it is well known that they knew SOMETHING was going to happen... whether they knew it was in New York etc is unknown though.

But I have read a few articles addressing the apparent arbitrary latency in the US Air Defense response to the FAA and ATC orders.

Here's a very good source:

http://standdown.net/

Lots of information on 911 and what happened, minute by minute.

"Hating everyone protects me from elitism."

Decius,

I read an article on September 7th of this year in the Sacramento Bee (newspaper) on "Four widows on a quest for truth about 9/11" it states that in a meeting at the J. Edgar Hoover FBI building with FBI director Robert Mueller III, "...four planes that the government had been forwarned could be used as weapons-even bombs-but chose to ignore."

One of the widows, Kristen Breitweiser asked Mueller "I don't understand, with all the warnings about the possibilities of al-Qaida using planes as weapons, and the Phoenix memo from one of your own agents warning that Osama bin Laden was sending operatives to this country for flight school training, why didn't you check out flight schools before September 11th?"
To which he answers "Do you know how many flight schools there are in the U.S.? Thousands. We couldn't have investigated them all and found these few guys."
And then she rebuttles "Wait, you just told me there were too many flight schools and that prohibited you from investigating them before 9/11, how is it that after a few hours after the attacks, the nation is brought to its knees, and miraculously FBI agents showed up at Embry Riddle flight school in Florida where some of the terrorists trained?"
"We got lucky" was the reply.

"I'd like to say something profound....."SOMETHING PROFOUND""

Just another old war story . .
I was pulled for some clean up detail, went around the air air base picking up trash cans and took them to the dump. We load the 6x and head across the vill into the hills. Coming to the dump, we lock and load, perching ourselves along the rails (side boards). Smiling and waving South Vietinese come running toward the truck, our vigil eyes narrow as they unload the truck. I watch a middle age woman running foward from a cardboard shanty, hhe children gathered at the entrance. Her gait is a lopsided as the oversized combat boots, laces trailing behind her hinder her progress. People scavenge the our waste, sitting aside pieces of cardboard upon which they deposit the meat. Seems the US soldiers didn't care much for the green meat in their brown bag lunch so the remains had been deposited into the waste.
False Pride
Thinking of happy faced woman running for such scraps filled me with distaste, the fooliishness of youth. I thought to myself like hell I would live like that. Better to rob and even kill before I would submit to such disgrace.

"Terrorist or tyrant, few may come to the Truth that both are poor choice."